Jacob Walters and Austin Williams: Making Custom Bats at JAW Bats

INTROWelcome to In A World With Real Media. I'm your host, Brad Burrow. In this podcast, we'll dive into the lives of the most successful people in business. We'll learn how they overcame adversity, took advantage of opportunities and learned from their experiences. Learn from our experts. It inspired, then go live your story. It's In a World with Real Media.

Brad BurrowHello and welcome to the In A World [00:00:30] With Real Media Podcast. I'm Brad Barrow, and my special guests today are from a company in Baldwin, Missouri, or Kansas, I should say JAW Bats. And I've been following you guys for a long time. I mean, your Instagram videos are, um, you know, pretty addictive by the way. Um, Jacob Walters is the founder, right? Mm-hmm. and Austin Williams is, uh, I'm not exactly sure. Are you the kind of the operations guy?

Austin WilliamsYep. More the operations, manufacturing.

Brad BurrowYeah. Yep. So [00:01:00] let's just start from the beginning. I really, really interested to Jacob, why, why start a bat company?

Jacob WaltersYou know, it was, it was one of those things where, you know, I, I was very passionate about baseball, of course, and then also woodworking. Uh, woodworking was big in my family, in, um, you know, very artistic family as well. I had no skills. So I was like, man, I, I don't know where my artistic side fits in this family. And got into wood turning at a really young age, about 14, 15, and figured, you know, hey, why not try to [00:01:30] make a bat and, you know, swing it? And, uh, they were pretty terrible for a long time. . So, but one of those things where you just obsess over and, um, yeah, just try to get better. And I think, fortunately, I was very self-aware that they weren't very good. And, um, but yeah, it's just obsession. So just kept making 'em for friends and myself, and, um, finally kind of figured it out over the years.

Brad BurrowBut, so when you say they weren't very good, what, what did you mean by that?

Jacob WaltersIt's a tough thing to do. So, you know, it's just getting the, the weight distribution correct and the flow of the [00:02:00] bat. And, um, you know, figuring out colors and correct finish and, you know, all the things that go into manufacturing, any product,

Brad BurrowThe type of wood too?

Jacob WaltersType of wood. Yeah. So, you know, fortunately I think I, uh, figured out the wood fairly early. Um, you know, it's very expensive, of course. But, uh, yeah, it's just one of those things where I had a high expectation for myself and, and standard. And, um, if that wasn't met, then I wanted to get better. Yeah. So I think that helped me tremendously.

Brad BurrowSo, weight distribution, that's gotta be a big deal. I mean, [00:02:30] you know, every, every hitter's different. Mm-hmm. , I mean, I'm assuming you're building the bats, four hitters, A lot of this, excuse me, the stuff that I see, you know, like this stuff is just cool looking. You know, so are people actually using those to in games?

Jacob WaltersYeah. We, we have even crazier ones that guys swing now in games. Um, yeah. It's, you know, for us it was always, we wanted it to look cool as well as, you know, performance and feel was always number one. But you wanna look good and, and have a cool product. So, um, like our most popular [00:03:00] bat now is a pink and blue bat. So, uh, when Austin and I were playing that you probably couldn't get away with pink and blue, but now I think it's more acceptable. And, um, the game's getting less traditional, which I think is good.

Brad BurrowYeah. But, yeah. Got the Savannah Bananas. Oh, yeah. Are you doing bests for them? I should. We look

Jacob WaltersLike you had mm-hmm. . We did a banana bat for them, and yeah. So those are fun.

Brad BurrowYeah. That's cool. So, so you had this woodworking background, I guess mm-hmm. , I mean, and decided to one day make a [00:03:30] bat, and, and it just kind of took off from there.

Jacob WaltersYep. I, my family's always, you know, my dad can, you know, rebuild a car or, or build a house or whatever it may be. And, um, for me, I, I didn't have a lot of patience, so I got into wood turning. Um, I think the joke in the wood turning, or the woodworkers community is wood turners or woodworker with no patience. So , um, yeah, that just kind of seemed to be my thing, you know? And it was different from what everybody else was doing in the family. So, um, yeah, it just, you carve out your niche.

Brad Burrow[00:04:00] Boy, I am obsessed with the, uh, the word turning videos, though. It's, it's fun to watch, you know, what, what people do.

Jacob WaltersVery satisfying. Mm-hmm.

Brad Burrow. Yeah. Pretty cool. Your videos are, are legendary, man. Oh,

Jacob WaltersThank you. Yeah,

Brad BurrowPretty cool stuff, you know, seeing, seeing how the bats come together and stuff. Mm-hmm. . Um, so tell me a little bit about, um, and Austin, you can jump in here too. I, I really want to hear about your baseball background. You know, that, obviously we're a baseball family, so we're, we're really interested in that. And, um, we've [00:04:30] done a lot of work with the Royals and Reds and Mets and all kinds of stuff here. So really interested in kind of your background. You went to Neosho?

Jacob WaltersI did. Yep. So

Brad BurrowWhere'd you play college or, uh, high school?

Jacob WaltersSo I went to Shawnee Mission Northwest. Okay. Grew up in Overland Park area. Actually, my, my grandma, uh, lived not too far from here, so. Oh, is that right? You know, it's a very sentimental area for me, but yeah. Um, yeah, so, you know, played at Shawnee Mission Northwest. Went off to Neosho, played there for two years. Um, played with an awesome group of guys. Lucked out big time. Went to the [00:05:00] World Series. Both the years I didn't do anything, but, um, got to watch them and, and going into my sophomore year is when I started the company, so I stopped playing after those two years and, and went after the company, you know, so time to make money.

Brad BurrowSo you probably could have went and played D1 or D2 if you wanted to, right?

Jacob WaltersI don't think so. Um, my career didn't go the exact way I wanted. Uh, I was more athletic and, and fast, and I, for some reason decided to become a pitcher only and had no business on the mound. You know, I was 150 pounds with no [00:05:30] legs and no butt, so , uh, couldn't throw very hard. My shoulder was done. Um, so, and I just didn't work hard enough at hitting, uh, I should have, but yeah. You know, you always look back and think you could have done more. So I think that was my route, for sure.

Brad BurrowYeah. Now, Austin, tell, tell me about your role with the company, and then I want to hear about your background in baseball as well.

Austin WilliamsSo, kind of my role with, uh, with JAW is to basically up our anti with the manufacturing piece. Make sure we're ready to take the next, uh, steps that are necessary for [00:06:00] what we have plans in the future. Hopefully working with MLB guys. Yeah. Um, expanding the company and just helping Jacob grow the, the foundation that he has. He has started with JAW Bats. Yeah.

Brad BurrowUm, I wanna hear more about that too, by the way.

Austin WilliamsSo, yeah, I guess how I met Jacob was actually through baseball. Uh, would've been 2008 or 2009. Mm-hmm. . We both played for the Johnson County Hornets now between the lines here for Bob Jones. Um, did a summer there. And then, uh, [00:06:30] I'm a two years older. Yeah. Mm-hmm. two years older, so we didn't compete against each other. I went to Fort Scott after that. Yeah. Um, from 2009-2011. Then after Fort Scott went to Eastern Michigan, um, for two years

Brad BurrowThat's D1, right?

Austin WilliamsYep. In the Mac conference. Yep. Yeah. So it's pretty great time. Great time. So,

Brad BurrowWhat'd you guys do this time of year? Hard to play baseball in Eastern Michigan this time of year?

Austin WilliamsYeah. Yeah. It's so, uh,

Jacob WaltersTough it out.

Brad BurrowYeah.

Austin WilliamsYeah. You just wear the cold weather, basically. [00:07:00] Uh, keep, try to keep the snow off the turf field and, and practice. And we had a bubble, um, as well that, that we would get a practice in.

Brad BurrowUm, did you do road trips south every year?

Austin WilliamsYeah. Road trip south every year. Basically start in like the Carolinas or Arizona, that sort of thing. So the, the travel for a, a northern school to start the year gets pretty, pretty daunting Yeah. In a way. And it, it makes school very challenging at times. Yeah. Just being gone consistently. [00:07:30] But I think with, with more and more teams having turf now, that has, has really helped with, uh, with being able to stay a little closer to home and do a little, little bit less traveling. Yeah. Which is, is nice for the kids at times. So yeah, it was the funnest thing's, always playing as a mid-major division one playing at the big schools, all your power five schools. Yeah. So

Brad BurrowSeeing some legit talent on some of those teams, aren’t you?

Austin WilliamsDefinitely, definitely. So, yeah, we gotta play Arizona. [00:08:00] Um, when they won the Carls World Series, we went out to Arizona and Tuscan and played a series there and got waxed pretty good. . But did you, uh, those games are awesome. Mid still fun, mid major fun, still fun. You have nothing to lose, you know? So yeah. All the pressures on, on those Power five teams

Brad BurrowNow. What position did you play?

Austin WilliamsUh, played mostly third base. Okay. Yep. So kind of little bit all around, played little shortstop, little second base, third base, pitched just a touch.

Brad Burrow[00:08:30] Can you, can you guys tell, like, especially from a hitting standpoint, when a bat is, is set up correctly mm-hmm. ? Oh, yeah. Like if, if you like weight distribution now mm-hmm. , I mean, you probably can just pick it up and know, right? Yeah.

Jacob WaltersYeah. Like, when we talk about this all the time when we were kids, there just wasn't great, you know, a ton of options out there. Yeah. Or, or good options. And it's like, man, these beds always feel so heavy or feel terrible. And a lot of times they were, you know, drop one’s instead of drop three’s. And, um, the, the model spec wasn't [00:09:00] great. And so that was kind of a driving factor when, when I started making bats, I just wanted to make something that felt perform better. Yeah. But yeah, we talk about it all the time. Just, you know, the feel of certain bats are just not good.

Brad BurrowYeah. Yeah. That's interesting. So Jacob, I wanted to talk a little bit about your personal drive. I mean, not too many guys coming outta college say, Hey, I'm gonna start a business mm-hmm. . And it's, uh, it's not easy, is it?

Jacob WaltersYeah. I, I think maybe I was too young and dumb to know otherwise, you know, didn't know what you're [00:09:30] getting into. It's still young and dumb, but, um, yeah, I think that's the, the thing is you just, you just need to start doing something, you know? I think a lot of people get so caught up in the business plan and, and trying to figure out what they want to do. And I was very fortunate to already know what I loved and wanted to do. And, you know, if if it wasn't a business, I was still gonna do it. It's just, you know, fortunately I had a entrepreneurial mindset and wanted to, you know, create something that I could work for myself for. Yeah.

Brad BurrowYou know? So you just basically started from nothing [00:10:00] and Yeah.

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm.

Brad Burrow. So tell me, tell me about that process. I mean, social media was probably around there. Yeah. A lot different than it is now, probably, but Yeah. I mean, starting, how did you build it?

Jacob WaltersYeah, it was social media, you know, that was all I had. Uh, you know, my, my, I grew up middle class, you know, upper, maybe upper middle class. My dad construction, uh, foreman plumber, my mom, uh, worked for wastewater treatment facility in, uh, Smith and Loveless. So we, I mean, we always had money we never needed, [00:10:30] you know, or had to go without. Uh, so I was very fortunate and, and they were very supportive. Um, but I'm also the kid that doesn't like to borrow when I don't need to, you know? Yeah. So I would just buy billets when I could and, and sell 'em and, you know, use that money to buy more. And, um, you know, I became very good at being frugal with, with the money. And, um, and it was just, it was all about wanting to make the bad. It wasn't about making money, you know? And I, I'm a big believer [00:11:00] in do what you love and money follows. And, um, I think I was fortunate enough to, to get in that position. But, you know, that builds a lot of character too, I think, when, when you're strapped for cash one year or one month, and you have to do what you can to get by. Yeah. But, yeah.

Brad BurrowSo not easy being an entrepreneur, is

Jacob WaltersIt? That's for sure.

Brad BurrowYeah. A lot of battles. Yeah. Where, where did the name come from? Job Pats?

Jacob WaltersIt's my initials. Um, it's kind of one of those days in the dorm when you're just brainstorming and going through fonts and, um, you kind of don't remember [00:11:30] the, the evolution of the name or the logo, but, uh, just one day it's there. So

Brad BurrowDid you come up with the logo?

Jacob WaltersUh, kind of, yeah. Yeah. So initially we had the J and the W and then we had a lowercase a in between the J and the W. And one of my customers who played for the blue js, um, he said, why don't you just put a line through the j and w? Yeah. I was like, oh, that's perfect. So yeah, a lot of people don't see it, you know, like JW Bats, it's like, oh,

Brad BurrowNo. Yeah, . Yeah. No, that's awesome. Yeah. Um, [00:12:00] so basically you just, you started it and it's kind of been building, I mean, you guys have been around for

Jacob WaltersYeah. Over 10 years. 10

Brad BurrowYears, yeah. I mean, that's, that's a success story in itself.

Jacob WaltersYeah. Yeah. We grew up very slow, like I said, young and dumb, so I didn't know what I was doing. Um, but I'm very fortunate that we grew it slow that way. I think I avoided many mistakes, and, uh, just tried to do it by myself for way too long, and very fortunate to have Austin with me and yeah. Uh, the last year. But yeah, just social media was big for us, [00:12:30] you know, it started on Twitter in college, uh, kind of before Instagram was big. Uh, we do giveaways all the time to build followers, and, um, and then Instagram became a huge platform for us Yeah. With the visuals. And, and then TikTok too is huge for us.

Brad BurrowSo Yeah. TikTok is kind of taking over it. Oh, yeah. Just feels like mm-hmm. , at least for the younger, younger audiences, right?

Jacob WaltersYeah. Yeah. It's, we, we kind of cheat. It's very visual, so it's easy for us, but yeah. Um, but you still have to be very cons, especially now, it's very difficult now, um, to be consistent [00:13:00] and put out good product and content.

Brad BurrowSo, talk to me, I mean, you guys do some really creative things with bats. I mean, I've, I've seen lots of the different ones. Splattering paint using, you know, torches to, to do the lines and stuff. That's really cool. I mean, how are you coming up with the, the creative side?

Jacob WaltersYou know, either between Austin and I, or most of the time it's our customers, you know, it's, they'll be like, Hey, can you make this for us? And it's like, well, I give it a shot. Yeah. And then end up being one of our hot sellers. So like our, [00:13:30] our cotton candy bat, which is our hottest seller right now, that was designed by like an 11 year old, you know? Is that right? Yeah. Yep. So, yeah.

Brad BurrowWhat is the cotton candy bat? Tell me what that is.

Jacob WaltersSo it's hot pink fade to aqua blue with pink splatter on the handle. Oh, okay. So it's just, you know, loud and very bright and colorful, and it's what guys love now. So

Brad BurrowLike, who's using those bats? I mean, who, who would, who would, um, everybody.

Austin WilliamsEverybody. Anybody from 12, [00:14:00] 13, maybe even younger to high school kids even. Um, so maybe even some college kids. Yeah.

Brad BurrowSo yeah, wood bat tournaments and things.

Austin WilliamsWood bat tournaments, I guess, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. . So, thankfully, like most of your good high school baseball now is turned to more of a wood bat tournament situation, whereas in the past, there's been more of a, a metal bat Yeah. Use. So that's, it's been helpful and very cool for us to be able to work with more, more and more kids, and get 'em a quality piece of wood that they can make their own.

Brad BurrowSo, talk to me [00:14:30] a little bit about, you know, on the business side, what are some of the challenges? I mean, a lot of, you know, we've come through the pandemic supply chain things. I don't know if that's impacting you guys. Um, what, what are some of the challenges that you've had to overcome?

Jacob WaltersYeah. The, the biggest challenge is just cost of wood. Um, wood is very expensive, especially at our caliber. Um, so that was an issue. We had a supply chain issue with the wood as well for a while. Um, I think we went, what, four months, five months, without getting wood in mm-hmm. , [00:15:00] our shelves were just cleared, you know, which was scary.

Brad BurrowBut how do you make it through that?

Jacob WaltersYou just do? Um, fortunately we weren't, it wasn't a super busy time, and, uh, we kind of had enough to get us through. Um, but yeah, it was, it was some sketchy moments there. Yeah. And, you know, being a smaller company, we are okay, but I can't imagine being a company that just pumps thousands of bess out a day, you know? So we are very fortunate to get through that. But other than that, it's, you know, all of our product is domestic, [00:15:30] so we're pretty, um, pretty fortunate with

Brad BurrowThis. So nothing overseas or anything like that? Not really. Where, where do you get wood for a bat? I mean,

Jacob WaltersYeah, I'll, I'll kinda let

Brad BurrowYou, I don't know if you can diviv

Austin WilliamsDivulge. So most of our billets come from like upstate New York, Pennsylvania area. Okay. The distributor. And then, we'll, we'll get, start getting some from like the Northern Ontario up in Canada, really down to as well,

Brad BurrowBecause that's where the, the wood.

Austin WilliamsYeah. They're

Brad BurrowGetting the wood

Austin WilliamsGenerally, like your hard maple and birch [00:16:00] comes from kind of the northeast where they have the hardy winters, actually, the hardier, the winter to, from my understanding, the more stress the tree goes under, the harder the wood's going to be, the better the wood's gonna be up there. And they just have a lot more old growth wood up that way versus here, kind of in the Midwest as well. Um, yeah. Yeah. You,

Jacob WaltersYou just want very consistent straight growth, you know? And, and like you said, those hard winters can create very dense wood. So,

Brad BurrowSo [00:16:30] what does it look like when you get, I mean, do you get like, I mean, it's gotta be a certain size, right? Mm-hmm. , are they like, like posts type thing? Or what, what does it

Austin WilliamsLook like? They come in a cylindrical, so they're 37 inches long, 2.55 inches in diameter, 75 8

Jacob WaltersOr so

Austin WilliamsMm-hmm. . Yeah. Depending on who's sending them to us Yeah. As a little bit different mm-hmm. , uh,

Brad BurrowMeasure. So they're kind pre-cut, ready to put on, put correct, put on the, uh,

Jacob WaltersYep. Fortunately

Brad BurrowLaid.

Jacob WaltersYeah. We don't have to do all that legwork. Yeah. [00:17:00] Yep. But,

Brad BurrowYep. And then you have a pretty good idea of what the quality of the wood, I mean, you like checking moisture and stuff like that, or,

Jacob WaltersYeah, so we, we get it in, uh, we know it's, I believe it's dried to 6%, I think. Mm-hmm.

Brad BurrowIs what it is. I was wondering if Yeah. You had parameters around that

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm. . So it, it gets in, we unload it, weigh everything, grade everything, uh, number it, uh, sort it away, you know, put it away. Um, and then we have a temperature and humidity controlled room that it goes in. And, um, so we stabilize it, hopefully in, in there and, yeah. You [00:17:30] know, so,

Brad BurrowSo can you tell by looking at a piece of wood, if it's like, when you're saying grading it, like you can tell pretty easily if it's good or not?

Jacob WaltersYeah. Mm-hmm. , yes. We, we check for, you know, we want wide, far apart grains. We want super straight grains. And then you can also kind of tell by the color, um, you know, if Maple has this like iridescent look to it, it usually isn't very dense and doesn't turn very well. Um, and you can kind of feel it and, and see, huh. The difference. Yeah.

Brad BurrowWhat do you do with that?

Jacob Walters[00:18:00] Make display orders, you know, display only orders

Brad BurrowOr something that wouldn't be used in mm-hmm. in actual hitting situations.

Jacob WaltersYeah. It's the bane of our existence. . Mm-hmm. .

Brad BurrowSo, well, you can figure out how to make money on that. Yeah.

Jacob WaltersYeah.

Brad BurrowThat's, uh, maybe those are the ones that you need to do for corporate logos and stuff like that, huh?

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm. , that's what we do, so,

Brad BurrowYeah. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. Cool. So the creative designs, you, you, uh, get those a lot from, from customers that come in. Do you have any, I know you, you probably do have some influencer [00:18:30] type guys, you know, players using your bats. Is there any MLB guys using stuff right now?

Jacob WaltersYeah, so we're, we're not legally MLB certified yet. We're working to do that for hopefully next year. Um, it's just a expensive process that we've stayed out

Brad BurrowOf. Can't even imagine. Yeah.

Jacob WaltersBut we've worked with guys in the past, um, Yas Money Grand Doll, and, um, a few other guys, so that we just try to stay out of it, you know, so we don't get in trouble. , um, we don't want any sanctions to come down on us, so, so what,

Brad BurrowWhen we do, I mean, would you [00:19:00] be sanctioned if they used a bat in the game? We

Jacob WaltersCould probably get in pretty deep trouble. Really? Yeah. Because, you know, it's, it's pretty pricey to get up there. Um, we've gotten phone calls in the past seeing like, Hey, we found your, your bat in our clubhouse. You know, it's like, well, I, I don't know what to tell you. We're just selling bats to guys, you know? No

Brad BurrowKidding.

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm. . So we, we don't want to ruffle feathers, you know, we'd like to work with the MLB someday, so we don't want to piss anybody off.

Brad BurrowWow. Isn't that incredible? I mean, that's just, I don't know. That's disappointing [00:19:30] to me.

Jacob WaltersYeah. It's a little frustrating. So

Brad BurrowIs it because they have contracts with, you know, the other bat manufacturers, the big bat manufacturers and that type of thing that,

Jacob WaltersYeah, I mean, obviously everything's always a money thing. So it's contracts and sponsorships. And then also you, you do have to regulate the product. It's, you know, it's the single handle, handle single handedly controls the outcome of the game. You know, a good bad is gonna help you perform better. And if, you know, we have density laws that we have to abide by, so if we're [00:20:00] not abiding by those laws, then we could give a player an advantage over another player. And so I understand the, the regulatory aspect of

Brad BurrowThat. Yeah. So are you guys, is that a place that you want to go? I mean, do you want to go that direction? I mean, that would change the company a lot, wouldn't

Jacob WaltersIt? Yeah. Yeah. Ego wise, I think both of us would like to see our, our stuff on tv. So Yeah.

Brad BurrowThat'd be

Jacob WaltersAwesome. Yeah. It's just, it, we stayed out for so long cause we didn't want to get put ourself in a position where, you know, say things go well for us and we can't keep up with production, [00:20:30] and then our name goes to crap, you know? So, uh, we've stayed out in, and also the, the fee, the initial fee to get in. If, if you're paying that much money, you better sell some product, you know? No kidding. So that's the big reason why we've stayed out. Um, I think we're at a position now where we're ready to force ourselves into expansion that way. Um, and our product's always been ready. Guys wanna swing 'em. We've been around long enough that we have players that are growing up and, you know, are now getting drafted and would like [00:21:00] to keep swinging in our product, and we'd like to be able to take care of 'em. So yeah, that's, that's the issue we see now.

Brad BurrowSo, so what is your marketing strategy right now? I'm really interested, you know, in this, I mean, is it college? Is it, is it youth? Mm-hmm. , youth Baseball? I mean,

Jacob WaltersYeah, kind of both. I mean, I kinda let you take that over. It's, you've been doing a lot of the, the business development marketing now, but

Austin WilliamsYeah, it kind of starts with just, uh, thankfully a lot of our customers, we have really good customer support. A lot of people in our [00:21:30] corner, particularly like baseball academies, are a good start. Getting some good product in kids' hands and got saw

Brad BurrowBC on

Austin WilliamsBc bc. Jeremy's been Jacob's number one supporter from the get-go, so, yeah. Uh, that's great. They've, and, and they're just turned into an awesome, awesome place over there at, at BC and just like getting the name out, getting a product out part they

Brad BurrowJust sold, by the way.

Austin WilliamsMm-hmm. . Yep.

Jacob WaltersYeah's been huge for them. Uhhuh. ,

Austin WilliamsYeah. Very happy for, yeah. Homefield that if you haven't checked [00:22:00] out Homefield, that facility is unbelievable. Yeah. So

Brad BurrowBri actually works there. Yeah. Oh, perfect. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah,

Jacob WaltersSo you definitely know all about

Brad BurrowIt. Yeah. We, we know Jamie, um, uh, what's the pitching coach that's over there with, used to be at the Royals anyway,

Austin WilliamsJamie Bluma.

Brad BurrowBluma. Yeah.

Austin WilliamsBluma. Yeah. I actually took lessons from Jamie when I was a little tyke, so years ago. Nice too. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, we love him. He, his thing like, put some ketchup on it, you know, throw the ball hard, you know, so it was

Brad BurrowPretty funny. Yeah.

Austin WilliamsGood, [00:22:30] good personality, dude. Yeah. Fun guy. Yeah. But kind of our marketing, I've just been reaching out and reaching out and reaching out and, uh, just trying to get people to swing our product and send out a few demos here and there. We're not in a really, a great position to give away a bunch of product. It's obviously always better business model for people to pay for product. Yes. Um, um, but, um, a few demos there and, um, just setting out some demo days with indoor facilities, [00:23:00] baseball facilities, colleges. So, um, I guess for me, the, the baseball facilities probably the easiest place to start. Yeah. Um, as we've, I've tried to reach out to a few of the summer leagues and teams I've played with in the past. Uh, funding's quite an issue and kind of, they've had to kind of ban band together as a, a whole league to, to purchase ma lower quality bats, unfortunately.

Austin WilliamsSo it's, it's just a, it's an [00:23:30] everyday task to convince sim you'll pay the same amount and get a better product. You won't need 40, 60 bats for the summer. You, you might need 12 a dozen or, or 20 we'll get you through. So the, the cost is gonna end up being about the same. Um, but it's just, uh, a daunting, daunting task. You almost have to have, uh, I think that's where baseball really helps us, being former players, being former athletes. Yeah. You just, you [00:24:00] just grind it out, you know, you're gonna fail. People are gonna say no, but you just, you just keep with it, man. We're pretty used

Jacob WaltersTo failing with baseball.

Austin WilliamsYou and, uh, yeah. 30%. It's just the way it is. You know, it's just, uh, for an opportunity loss is an opportunity gained,

Brad BurrowYou know, it's really interesting that, that you say that cuz we're, uh, Bri and I are talking a lot about this right now and, and there's companies like Northwestern Mutual and companies like that, that really want athletes mm-hmm. because they know that [00:24:30] you've been dedicated, you've worked hard, especially college athletes specifically, and they know that you are good with, uh, overcoming objections and Right. And failure. Cuz that's what athletes do, right? Yeah. That's how you get better. Yeah. It's really interesting. So it takes a certain mentality to do that. Right,

Jacob WaltersRight. Nothing much worse than going oh, for four, you know, in a day and then everybody making fun of you. So it's, it's, you know, you, you build some, uh, character that way and,

Brad BurrowBut you come back the next day and you're [00:25:00] like, okay, yeah, let, let's start all over.

Jacob WaltersYep. They go for four again. You know, you never know. So,

Austin WilliamsYeah. But yeah, it, it, it, it to me like the whole like marketing and sales is very similar to hitting Yeah. In baseball per se. You go Oh, for, for the week and then that next week you might hit seven bombs. Yeah. You know, it's just like something like, you don't even know what you did different or what, it just happens that way. So just consistent effort [00:25:30] is kind of my kind of theme is just staying consistent. Yeah. Sticking with it and, and just trying to build. Right.

Brad BurrowIf you do the work, it's gonna pay off, you know, eventually. Yeah. If that's the, that's the thing about it. But a lot, if you're on this emotional rollercoaster, those are the people that really struggled with sales. Yeah. Cuz the ups and downs, the ups are high and the downs are low, right?

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm. . Yeah. I used to work with a guy early on in the business and good friend of mine and he, he was older and, uh, he's like, man, you never [00:26:00] get excited about anything. It's like, no need, you know, just let's just keep riding, you know? Yeah. It's like, cuz there's gonna be a day where I'm gonna have a really bad day and I try not to get too low there too, so. Yeah. Yeah. It's, and I think it, what we've always done a good job of is really staying true to who we are. And that's quality and performance and mm-hmm. and also the look. And, um, you know, that's not for everybody. If, if you're looking for a discount bat, we're just not your people. So, um, have

Brad BurrowYou, have you thought about expanding, like, into other markets? Like, you [00:26:30] know, I could see giving a real media bat to somebody mm-hmm. , you know, something like that, or just as an idea. And I've, I've been to, in the past, I've been to trade shows where we got these little bats that were engraved and stuff like that. I've was kind of cool. Have you thought about, you know, or you just wanna stay in that lane of, of performance?

Jacob WaltersYeah. We've, we actually do a ton of display and corporate bats that we call, um, or senior display bats mm-hmm. . Um, so we like this getting ready here in the next month. Uh, we do a ton of [00:27:00] high school senior and college senior display bats for, you know, gifts for their seniors. Yeah. Um, so we do a ton of that stuff that's really supplemental to our, to our wood supply. You know, we can get rid of some of the, the crap wood that isn't good enough for, you know, game

Brad BurrowUse. Who would even know mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Yeah. Exactly. So that's, that's been a huge thing for us, especially since our, our product is pretty, you

Brad BurrowKnow mm-hmm. , uh, what, what are you doing marketing wise with something like that? I mean, it seems like that could be, you know, something on your website or [00:27:30] mm-hmm. , you know, you could, you could generate leads that

Austin WilliamsWay. Definitely. Mostly email. Mm-hmm. email with coaches. Yeah. Um, probably get on Twitter. Uh, Twitter seems to be where the college baseball coaches hang out. They're not, not terribly involved with Instagram or TikTok or Yeah. Or whatnot. So we need to better Twitter. Um, yeah. Our involvement with Twitter probably needs, we need to get a better job. And we have an intern that plays at Baker that's really, really helping us out on the Twitter aspect. Taylor. So, um, thank you to him for shout, [00:28:00] shout out to Taylor for, shout out to Taylor, us there. Um, that's pretty big time for us to, that was a great idea for him to get us kind of restarted on that platform. Mm-hmm.

Brad Burrow, I, is your website helping in in those aspects at all? I mean, have you guys spent time on the website really kind of tweaking? I'm really curious just from like seo mm-hmm. , that kind of thing.

Jacob WaltersYeah. The, the website we need to, people say it's great, but I, it drives me nuts. I think there's a lot we could do to fix it and clean it up. Um, and we, we don't do any SEO marketing. Um, it's [00:28:30] a lot of word of mouth and, and Google and well, well, word of mouth and then Mark, uh, email marketing and then social media of course, but yeah. Right. Um, you know what it's the big problem with, with wood bats is the educational side behind it is, you know, we want our parents or the corporate office to be very comfortable with what they're purchasing or have an idea of what they're even purchasing, you know? Yeah. So I think we could do a better job on our website of being educational mm-hmm.

Brad Burrow. Yeah. I wonder if there's, uh, not to turn this into a [00:29:00] marketing session, but I wonder if there are, you know, companies out there that could refer clients to you guys mm-hmm. , you know, like corporate awards and stuff like that. Yeah. That mm-hmm. seemed like a pretty cool thing. Yeah, for sure. If you could, if you could make those contacts mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Yeah,

Brad BurrowFor sure. Yeah. I mean, I've thought about it since, uh, knowing you guys were gonna come here. It's like, man, I'd love to give away some bats. Oh,

Austin WilliamsYeah. Oh yeah. You know,

Brad BurrowYeah.

Jacob WaltersWe do. What a realtor group and

Austin WilliamsYeah. Corporate woods,

Jacob WaltersThey always do, you know, a bunch of bats for their, uh, top sellers [00:29:30] or top brokers mm-hmm. and yeah. So we just need to market better, really. We, I think we've kind of neglected that. We get so like, narrow focused on performance and, and game you stuff that we, I think we kind of forget to see what else we can do

Brad BurrowNow. How, how big is your staff right now?

Austin WilliamsYou're looking at it. Okay. Yep. Yeah,

Brad BurrowThat's what I was curious about. So that's one of the challenges, right? I mean, as a small business, I understand that completely, right? It's like, you've gotta wear so many hats. Yeah. Um, I mean, do you, do you [00:30:00] think you're prepared for growth? I mean, obviously there's things that would go into that. Like, do you have enough equipment? It's your facility there, sales wise, you know, all the stuff, even start thinking about accounting and Right. All those things.

Jacob WaltersYeah. We've, so this year is gonna be a very interesting year for us. Um, this past year we just brought on a partner, um, and that's been a huge help. So we're, we're able to get the resources that we need to really grow. And Yeah. And then bringing Austin on has been, I mean, I wish I would've done it [00:30:30] 10 years ago. Yeah. You know, it's, I don't know why I tried to do it by myself for so long, and I knew that you couldn't build a business by yourself. Um, I just, I really hum hamstrung the business for so many years, you know, which is fine. It, it's all a learning experience. Right. But, um, yeah, I think we're, we're very excited with what's to come this year. We're trying to expand the shop, you know, get a little more space. Is

Brad BurrowThat in Baldwin?

Jacob WaltersYeah. Okay. Mm-hmm. , I think

Brad BurrowYou think you'll stay there?

Jacob WaltersThat's the, that's the big question this year. Yeah. Is we'd like to get back [00:31:00] this way because we both grew up in this area and this is where, you know, all the people are, and for us, the customers that we do have in Kansas City, it's just, we, we'd like to be more around them. You know?

Brad BurrowDo you guys live in Baldwin or you? We

Jacob WaltersDo.

Austin WilliamsOkay. Yeah. Both of us do.

Jacob WaltersYeah. Okay. It's been a great town. We love it. Yeah. Yeah know.

Austin WilliamsYeah. Baldwin's been very good. That's how I actually, I reconnected with Jacob, uh, years ago when we lived in Baldwin. They moved to Baldwin. We actually both, ironically, less than a mile from each other in Lawrence and had no idea. Yeah. Oh yeah. When we were there. So, [00:31:30] um, going to Michigan and coming back, you kind of lose, lose track of some people and Right. Um, I'm not the most involved social media or, or phone guy, but, uh, yeah, we, my wife's like, Hey, they're having an open house at jaw bats. Do you know Jacob? I'm like, oh yeah, I played with Jacob and she's like, 15 years ago. Yeah. We should go down and see him and hopped in. And it just kind of would a Yeah. Would a spark necessarily. We then decided, Hey, let's hang out a little bit. Went on vacation and kind of, [00:32:00] yeah. We just slowly grown our friendship and now kind of partnership in a way here. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, just yeah. A small world, it's, it's funny how the world connects you Yeah. With certain people again. Yeah. So,

Brad BurrowSo tell me a little bit about what, what do you see for the future? What, what would you really like to see? Yeah, we,

Jacob WaltersYou know, I've really, next five years is to, you know, expand, increase our production. Uh, we'd like to get to, [00:32:30] we're, we're about two little over 2000 bats a year. I'd like to get to five to 10, uh, comfortably. I don't want to put ourselves in a position where we're sacrificing quality. Um, and then also MLB certified, become a respected company there. Um, but just maintain that, that quality that we're known for. And kind of exclusivity too. I, I like that idea of being exclusive and, um, but yeah, just a more well-rounded business that takes care of their customers and their people.

Brad BurrowFive x growth, that's, that's pretty, pretty big [00:33:00] goal.

Jacob WaltersYeah. I think, like I said, just the years before, you know, we've had the ability to grow, I just didn't allow it with, you know, not being able to do. I, I just got stuck making bats all day every day. Yeah. You know, before you know it, it's five years going by, it's like, we're not doing anything new. Um, so I think with the resources we have now with our partnership and, um, I think we can really take this thing to new

Brad BurrowLevels. So what are you, tell me your two roles, like Austin, yours, how are you different [00:33:30] from Jacob? Cuz that's honestly the reason I'm asking that question, because as an entrepreneur, you know, we've been in business 25 years and I've over the years done everything mm-hmm. , but it's hard to let go of certain things, you know? Yeah. How, how are you guys doing that?

Austin WilliamsYeah, so I do a lot of the manufacturing piece, um, pulling the billets, running them through the, the CNC machine, hand sanding. And then, uh, we kind of both have our own little quarters in the shop. I do the manufacturing, put on a car, Jacob Colors, [00:34:00] finishes the bats, and then we kind of double teamed the, the engraving piece and, um, kind of have everybody know you, not a huge staff. So everybody kind of wear certain hats at certain given times. So, um, contacting people, whatnot, email, we kind of all just take marketing that piece on. Um, Jacob's definitely more involved with say the, the social media piece where I, I really, I, I kind of thrive more of [00:34:30] an email face-to-face. Yeah. Um, sort of meeting with, I, I really like working with the college teams. Um, that's kind of, I, that's just my, what I enjoy. And, uh, the, uh, the kids at the training facilities here in town too. I just getting, yeah. So that's kind of my role there and kind of we can all sort of do mm-hmm. fill in where is needed at times, but as we [00:35:00] grow, I think we're running into, we'll probably have to get the task and train more procedural esque, uh, with so people have direction Yeah. Onto what to do. So, yeah. Um,

Brad BurrowWe're going that right now, real media, we call 'em, um, standard operating procedures. Mm-hmm. . So we've just put a whole list of things that, that we're gonna, you know, line item out what needs to happen to achieve, [00:35:30] you know? Right. Podcasting or a location shoot or whatever it might be. But that's so that as we grow, we can bring people in and get 'em on board, you know, with, with what needs to happen pretty quickly. Mm-hmm. , so that's part of the growing Oh yeah. The growth aspect of things. Mm-hmm. and Yeah. I mean, you sounds like you need to be out on the road probably a lot more than, than, uh, turning bats, huh?

Jacob WaltersYeah. That's what I've really seen with that's been so huge bringing him on is, uh, the, the little things he does is, what I'm so appreciative [00:36:00] of is, you know, he's, he's so organized. I'm a absolute scatter brain, like my poor wife and, you know, even poor Austin over here, but he's very organized. He follows up with people, he creates contacts really quickly. Um, he's very consistent and he's really, you know, thrived in the business development side, in, in player development and stuff like that. Yeah. Um, so that's what I see him doing more long term. I think. So, yeah.

Brad BurrowYeah. So years ago we used to work with a company called Fighting. I don't know if you remember them. [00:36:30] Yeah. So we did all our TV spots and Oh, sweet. Um, but we would go down side, I would, uh, I did TV spots with Josh Beckett, and we were, you know, did a whole bunch of stuff like that, the Reds, but, um, the fighting guys from California, but they would go down to spring training and they would spend six weeks traveling to every team in, in, uh, Florida. And then they'd go to, to Arizona and do the same thing in spring training, but getting the guys to wear Oh yeah. To wear their necklaces,

Jacob Walters[00:37:00] You know, I've had a few of those .

Brad BurrowYeah. It really did work pretty good. Oh, yeah. I've worn 'em too. But, uh, you know, I just thinking about, you know, you get to the MLB level and it's like, you're gonna have to have a team traveling around just, Hey, check out the new bat, check this out. You know, that kind of thing. It's, it's a whole different level of business mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Yeah. Not a bad day when you get to go to Florida or Arizona in February, you know? Yeah. So, yeah. That's, that's definitely a role I see him doing. Um, he's very personable to those guys and, and I'd love to join him too, [00:37:30] if we could. And, um, yeah, it's, it's the exciting time. I, I've become obsessed with not only owning the business, but also learning how to manage people and, and creating an environment where they want to work for you. You know, obviously it's a very fun job, but Yeah. You know, that only goes so far if you're not taking care of people. So, yeah. It's, it's been very difficult for me to let go of stuff. Um, I did it a certain way for so long, and, you know, at first I'd be like, oh, don't pull the tape off that way. It [00:38:00] doesn't freaking matter how you pull the tape off as long as you get it done. Right. You know? So, um, I, I still struggle with letting go of some stuff. I'm, there's days where I'm sure I should just, you know, be hands off and let other people take care of it, and, uh, but I'm, I'm getting better. I think we'll see.

Brad BurrowAustin, are you having to train him in that area? Yeah.

Austin Williams, no, not really. I, I think I'm pretty understanding Yeah. In, in a way, you know, um, I mean, his name's on the bat, so you know, what, [00:38:30] what Jacob wants is kind of what, what goes Yeah. You know, and we can make adjustments here and there and, and just being real Yeah. You know, that's being truthful, um, with people and just being real with each other, you know? Yeah. We, uh, I mean, we're friends, but I mean, we have good days and bad days too. Yeah. You know, you, you can get frustrated with each other. So, um, the, the, I mean, there's gonna be challenges and it's just how you overcome that Yeah. Is what defines you and, [00:39:00] and, yeah. Um, you know, I know that about Jacob and we all have our strengths and weaknesses, and it's how do we, we gather those strengths and weaknesses for the better off of the team. So that's kind of, of the, the way I look at it. So your,

Brad BurrowYour, uh, baseball background's coming in right? There isn't

Austin WilliamsYeah. Mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Yeah. You gotta, it's for the team, you know? Mm-hmm. , it's the betterment of the, of the entire, it's not just about me anymore, you know? Yeah. So, and I think we had a good conversation initially of how we should have gone, you know, how we should go about this. You [00:39:30] know, it's always tough when you hire one of your best friends. So I think we have a good, uh, appreciation for each other and, and respect enough to know that yes, we are friends first. That's more important than, you know, the business side. And until we, we lift every morning so we get a, you know, get our anger out and lift in the morning , so it makes a day better. But Yeah. So

Brad BurrowIf, if you could give anybody advice that's maybe thinking about starting a business, what would you say to

Jacob Walters'em? For me, you know, my [00:40:00] situation, I say just start doing something. Um, I could only learn just doing it. You know, I, I don't learn in the classroom. I never had a business plan. I had to make a business plan to get a loan for a machine, but, um, at that point, yeah. You know, they just want to see a few things on a paper. But yeah. Um, for me it was just, just start doing something, you know, get in the field and start learning. If it's to go work for somebody for free in the industry that you wanna start a company in, do that. Or, um, you know, just do what you can to start.

Brad BurrowHave you [00:40:30] guys talked to the bats.com people? Oh yeah.

Jacob WaltersMm-hmm.

Jacob WaltersGood friends with

Brad BurrowThem. Are you? Mm-hmm. . Okay. Do you do, do you do some stuff with them?

Jacob WaltersWe've tried .

Brad BurrowI mean, I don't know why that wouldn't be a, I know, great thing for you to

Jacob WaltersDo. They love us. We love them. Um, I think they love us. Um, it's just, they're very corporate, which is, you know, it's a very big company. They it is. They've done a great job. Yeah. Running things. Uh, we're not MLB certified, so it's a little harder for a company like that to carry our stuff, you know, marketing aspect on their end. Um, so [00:41:00] yeah, we, I, I'm sure there's gonna be times where we're gonna work together, but mm-hmm. , you know, we'll

Brad BurrowSee. I mean, they gotta be one of the biggest distributors in the

Jacob WaltersNation. They are here. Yeah. They're, yeah, definitely the largest online retailer in the country, I think. Mm-hmm. .

Austin WilliamsYeah. So that's also something the next five years will probably expand on us more of like a retail space. Our niche is obviously the custom Yeah. Uh, bat. We, I think we're the only one that I know of that does a customizer with. You get to pick the feel of the bat and we'll give you the selected model, which I think [00:41:30] makes it a little bit easier if we haven't had, I think everybody that, from my knowledge, has loved the product. Mm-hmm. , we do live in the Midwest. We deal with the Midwest. Nice. Like Yeah. We want, we want feedback if you're not happy with the product. Yeah. You know, but, uh, from my understanding, I think that's a, that's our little niche, but to scale that from a manufacturing side is, is tough to figure out. Yeah. Um, so that's where like we need to expand is more in the retail area, more [00:42:00] stock items. And that'll come along with the MLB guys. They won't generally MLB regulates colorways and whatnot, so that they'll be more stock bats, ask what makes production a little bit easier on us. Yeah. So that, that's when we can, I see us getting into more retail spaces with more stock items, so,

Brad BurrowAnd you can grow too fast. Yeah. You know? Mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Yeah. We've seen it in the industry

Brad BurrowFor sure. Yeah. I mean, you hit an MLB thing, or bats.com decides [00:42:30] they want to carry a whole bunch of bats. I mean, now all of a sudden, how do you fulfill those orders? And I mean, that's a, a whole nother

Austin WilliamsHeadache and keeping everybody happy is can be quite the challenge. Yeah.

Brad BurrowMm-hmm. , well, about, let's, uh, let's wrap it up at what, what's the future look like? Tell me what, do you see some things coming down the pike that are pretty cool?

Jacob WaltersYeah, I think, uh, we've got someone in the works now for maybe, um, expanding our manufacturing to, [00:43:00] to the Kansas City area. Uh, it's very early in that we don't, we don't know. We could be staying in Baldwin, who knows. Yeah. Um, you know, that's one of those things that we try not to talk too much about, but here I am always talking about it. So ,

Brad BurrowIt's on your mind. Yep.

Jacob WaltersYep. So, um, that, and then just the expansion, uh, we're working, bringing on metal bat option. Uh oh, really? So that would be nice. Can't beat 'em. Join them. Um, grips our own grips, batting gloves, kind of supplemental things to the brand. Um, I've always been a, a brand first [00:43:30] kind of guy. Yeah. And, um, obviously my passion and knowledge is in bats, but I see us being a more of a jaw sports than a jaw bats, um, thing. So yeah. It, it's, let's see where we can take this with other products and, um, that are adjacent to, you know, bats. And then from there, see what else we can bring in.

Brad BurrowYeah, that's great. Awesome. What do you think?

Austin WilliamsAwesome.

Brad BurrowGido on all that.

Austin Williams. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so yeah, just for me, our focus really is [00:44:00] making sure we produce a quality product. Mm-hmm. , that's number one goal. Um, if we, if we can't do it the right way, we're just not gonna do it at all. Yeah. So that's kind of our philosophy, and just as we grow, just making sure we stick with that. Yeah. That's kind of my main focus.

Brad BurrowSo if somebody wanted to get ahold of you, like, let's say, you know, a corporation wanted to do, you know, Cerner bats mm-hmm. , for example. Um, how would they get ahold of you?

Jacob WaltersIt's just info@jawbats.com. Um, you'll get [00:44:30] either Austin or I or Taylor. Um, and then we can work with you on a design and get something going. And yeah, we, we love doing those and they turn out great every time. It's such a good gift. And then also social media, direct messages through Instagram, Twitter, TikTok,

Brad BurrowTell us your handles on all those. Just

Jacob WaltersAt job ads. Just J W B A T S, uh, I think all in all, all, all three mm-hmm. . Yeah. And then, yeah, so,

Brad BurrowAnd then Austin and if a coach, you know, say a coach of a local program wanted to, to reach out Yeah, same [00:45:00] thing.

Austin WilliamsYep. Same thing. Info all bats. Um, and then we can filter it to my inbox, my email inbox and, and, and go from there. So that's generally the better way. Yeah. Better route to go or Instagram. Yeah.

Brad BurrowYeah. Yep. So the last thing is, uh, you know, it's in a world with real media, so this is your chance to become a voiceover star. Okay. So the key to this is that you have to get really close to the mic, and you gotta speak with that movie voice, like in a world. So yeah,

Jacob Walters[00:45:30] I guess I'll go first.

Brad BurrowIf you do a good job, you know, you might be able to have a secondary

Jacob WaltersCareer, so, right.

Austin WilliamsYes. In a world with real media in

Jacob WaltersA world. Okay. In a world with real media,

Austin WilliamsIn a world, with real media.

Jacob WaltersI don't think it was area. Now . But I don't want to reach out. Awesome.

Brad BurrowThat's awesome. All right. So thank you guys for joining us. I really appreciate it. And, uh, man, um, I may have your first, or I may have an order for you here pretty

Austin WilliamsSoon. Oh, oh, wonderful. Wonderful, man. What

Brad BurrowA real media bat. So bad. I can't stand [00:46:00] it. Yeah. But we might come down and videotape you making it.

Jacob WaltersYeah, let's do

Brad BurrowIt. So we'll shoot it in ak mm-hmm.

Jacob Walters. Awesome. Hey, I'm done. Awesome. Well, thank you guys so much for having us and what you do for businesses in Kansas City, and Yeah. We, we love Kansas City, so it's just, we feel so at home.

Austin WilliamsMm-hmm. . Yeah.

Brad BurrowYeah. We appreciate it. Well, thanks for joining us guys. Uh, feel, feel free to subscribe to the podcast. It's gonna be on YouTube, it'll be on, uh, all the major audio podcast platforms. And, uh, stay tuned for the next one. Appreciate

Jacob WaltersIt. [00:46:30] Thank you. Speaker 1: This has been in a World with Real Media. Thanks for joining us. And be sure to subscribe on iTunes and follow real media on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. So you never miss an episode.

OUTROThis has been In A World with Real Media. Thanks for joining us. And be sure to subscribe on iTunes and follow Real Media on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. So you never miss an episode.